~46~ President Biden ~46~

The odds are excellent that you will leave this forum hating someone.
kramerica.inc
Posts: 6211
Joined: Sun Jul 29, 2018 9:01 pm

Re: It's Official - Mr. President, #46, Joe Biden

Post by kramerica.inc »

dislaxxic wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 8:25 am
old salt wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 6:57 amOur founders were geniuses. Too bad that American Exceptionalism is now interpreted as White Supremacy.
Salty may be talking about MagaNation's interpretion, wherein he MEANT to say "Too bad that American Exceptionalism is now interpreted as White Exceptionalism."

See, it's a latent kinda thing... :?

..
It's a latent thing by racist morons. Just like the response by the other side's prejudiced morons is equally stupid.

How long do the racist institutions have to be gone and torn down before the country stops making excuses? How long until we lose the victimhood?

Gonna be a while more, no? Because you and I both know that blaming the generations of oppression and accepting victimhood is easier than hard work, self betterment, and personal responsibility.

That's a personal choice, not an inherent one. People need to make the right choice. Just like a child of an alcoholic chooses to break a string of substance abuse.
User avatar
MDlaxfan76
Posts: 25756
Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2018 5:40 pm

Re: It's Official - Mr. President, #46, Joe Biden

Post by MDlaxfan76 »

kramerica.inc wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 9:56 am
dislaxxic wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 8:25 am
old salt wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 6:57 amOur founders were geniuses. Too bad that American Exceptionalism is now interpreted as White Supremacy.
Salty may be talking about MagaNation's interpretion, wherein he MEANT to say "Too bad that American Exceptionalism is now interpreted as White Exceptionalism."

See, it's a latent kinda thing... :?

..
It's a latent thing by racist morons. Just like the response by the other side's prejudiced morons is equally stupid.

How long do the racist institutions have to be gone and torn down before the country stops making excuses? How long until we lose the victimhood?

Gonna be a while more, no? Because you and I both know that blaming the generations of oppression and accepting victimhood is easier than hard work, self betterment, and personal responsibility.

That's a personal choice, not an inherent one. People need to make the right choice. Just like a child of an alcoholic chooses to break a string of substance abuse.
Kram, do you truly believe there's one playing field for everyone?
seacoaster
Posts: 8866
Joined: Thu Aug 02, 2018 4:36 pm

Re: It's Official - Mr. President, #46, Joe Biden

Post by seacoaster »

DMac wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 9:54 am Wow, you boys are brutal, this doesn't sound/feel like coming together, unity, and healing to me. salty did say what he says he said, I remember. seacoaster said pretty much the same in that our institutions were set up so as to be able to handle a disaster the likes of Trump and they did. I had my doubts but they were right. The people saying the healing and coming together is going to take a long time (Trump's funk aint going away anytime soon) are right too, you can see that here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=45cYwDMibGo
TLD wrote:
"I thought Festivus was last month."
:lol: :lol:
Yes, Old Salt did say that, but I think his faith in those institutions was greater than mine. The systems of checks and balances worked badly -- if sufficiently for survival -- in the Trump years. And that was because of fidelity to party. One legacy of the Trump years is that it could happen here: we can see a roadmap for bringing one's party to heel; ensuring that the demagogue's party members in Congress effectively fail to exercise any restraining influence or power out of fear for their jobs; warping the institutions by bypassing Congress with "acting" cabinet secretaries, etc. In the end, I am grateful for the Constitution, but understand that a smarter person than Trump could have overcome it and those institutional and legal restraints. Post-truth in pre-fascist, and we should never forget it.
kramerica.inc
Posts: 6211
Joined: Sun Jul 29, 2018 9:01 pm

Re: It's Official - Mr. President, #46, Joe Biden

Post by kramerica.inc »

MDlaxfan76 wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 10:00 am
kramerica.inc wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 9:56 am
dislaxxic wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 8:25 am
old salt wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 6:57 amOur founders were geniuses. Too bad that American Exceptionalism is now interpreted as White Supremacy.
Salty may be talking about MagaNation's interpretion, wherein he MEANT to say "Too bad that American Exceptionalism is now interpreted as White Exceptionalism."

See, it's a latent kinda thing... :?

..
It's a latent thing by racist morons. Just like the response by the other side's prejudiced morons is equally stupid.

How long do the racist institutions have to be gone and torn down before the country stops making excuses? How long until we lose the victimhood?

Gonna be a while more, no? Because you and I both know that blaming the generations of oppression and accepting victimhood is easier than hard work, self betterment, and personal responsibility.

That's a personal choice, not an inherent one. People need to make the right choice. Just like a child of an alcoholic chooses to break a string of substance abuse.
Kram, do you truly believe there's one playing field for everyone?
No. I never said there was. There is certainly hidden, institutional racism everywhere. And those instances need to be eradicated whenever found.
But I also know that hard work and a persistent mindset and effort is stronger than any forces working against someone.
User avatar
youthathletics
Posts: 14443
Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2018 7:36 pm

Re: It's Official - Mr. President, #46, Joe Biden

Post by youthathletics »

kramerica.inc wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 10:43 am
MDlaxfan76 wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 10:00 am
kramerica.inc wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 9:56 am
dislaxxic wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 8:25 am
old salt wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 6:57 amOur founders were geniuses. Too bad that American Exceptionalism is now interpreted as White Supremacy.
Salty may be talking about MagaNation's interpretion, wherein he MEANT to say "Too bad that American Exceptionalism is now interpreted as White Exceptionalism."

See, it's a latent kinda thing... :?

..
It's a latent thing by racist morons. Just like the response by the other side's prejudiced morons is equally stupid.

How long do the racist institutions have to be gone and torn down before the country stops making excuses? How long until we lose the victimhood?

Gonna be a while more, no? Because you and I both know that blaming the generations of oppression and accepting victimhood is easier than hard work, self betterment, and personal responsibility.

That's a personal choice, not an inherent one. People need to make the right choice. Just like a child of an alcoholic chooses to break a string of substance abuse.
Kram, do you truly believe there's one playing field for everyone?
No. I never said there was. There is certainly hidden, institutional racism everywhere. And those instances need to be eradicated whenever found.
But I also know that hard work and a persistent mindset and effort is stronger than any forces working against someone.
+1

MD, do you believe there ever will be a level playing field? Curious, can you provide a list of what is left to fix and how to conquer that list?
A fraudulent intent, however carefully concealed at the outset, will generally, in the end, betray itself.
~Livy
kramerica.inc
Posts: 6211
Joined: Sun Jul 29, 2018 9:01 pm

Re: It's Official - Mr. President, #46, Joe Biden

Post by kramerica.inc »

Change is only scary to those unprepared for it.
User avatar
MDlaxfan76
Posts: 25756
Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2018 5:40 pm

Re: It's Official - Mr. President, #46, Joe Biden

Post by MDlaxfan76 »

kramerica.inc wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 10:43 am
MDlaxfan76 wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 10:00 am
kramerica.inc wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 9:56 am
dislaxxic wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 8:25 am
old salt wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 6:57 amOur founders were geniuses. Too bad that American Exceptionalism is now interpreted as White Supremacy.
Salty may be talking about MagaNation's interpretion, wherein he MEANT to say "Too bad that American Exceptionalism is now interpreted as White Exceptionalism."

See, it's a latent kinda thing... :?

..
It's a latent thing by racist morons. Just like the response by the other side's prejudiced morons is equally stupid.

How long do the racist institutions have to be gone and torn down before the country stops making excuses? How long until we lose the victimhood?

Gonna be a while more, no? Because you and I both know that blaming the generations of oppression and accepting victimhood is easier than hard work, self betterment, and personal responsibility.

That's a personal choice, not an inherent one. People need to make the right choice. Just like a child of an alcoholic chooses to break a string of substance abuse.
Kram, do you truly believe there's one playing field for everyone?
No. I never said there was. There is certainly hidden, institutional racism everywhere. And those instances need to be eradicated whenever found.
But I also know that hard work and a persistent mindset and effort is stronger than any forces working against someone.
Great...that would not have been a general reader's takeaway from your prior post as you seemed to imply that the 'racist institutions' had already been 'gone and torn down'...

Your second sentence of this response is certainly correct (IMO), however it seems to be cast as oppositional to the first...it needn't be that 'hard work and persistent mindset and effort' face more forces working against them for some than others based on their skin color or for that matter the systemic aftereffects of generations of such making the likelihood of one's birth circumstances markedly more challenging.

These are not "excuses", they are a persistent reality in our society, despite the progress made since Jim Crow.

I think you may agree with that, but your initial post certainly sounded different.
User avatar
MDlaxfan76
Posts: 25756
Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2018 5:40 pm

Re: It's Official - Mr. President, #46, Joe Biden

Post by MDlaxfan76 »

youthathletics wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 10:52 am
kramerica.inc wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 10:43 am
MDlaxfan76 wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 10:00 am
kramerica.inc wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 9:56 am
dislaxxic wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 8:25 am
old salt wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 6:57 amOur founders were geniuses. Too bad that American Exceptionalism is now interpreted as White Supremacy.
Salty may be talking about MagaNation's interpretion, wherein he MEANT to say "Too bad that American Exceptionalism is now interpreted as White Exceptionalism."

See, it's a latent kinda thing... :?

..
It's a latent thing by racist morons. Just like the response by the other side's prejudiced morons is equally stupid.

How long do the racist institutions have to be gone and torn down before the country stops making excuses? How long until we lose the victimhood?

Gonna be a while more, no? Because you and I both know that blaming the generations of oppression and accepting victimhood is easier than hard work, self betterment, and personal responsibility.

That's a personal choice, not an inherent one. People need to make the right choice. Just like a child of an alcoholic chooses to break a string of substance abuse.
Kram, do you truly believe there's one playing field for everyone?
No. I never said there was. There is certainly hidden, institutional racism everywhere. And those instances need to be eradicated whenever found.
But I also know that hard work and a persistent mindset and effort is stronger than any forces working against someone.
+1

MD, do you believe there ever will be a level playing field? Curious, can you provide a list of what is left to fix and how to conquer that list?
Long list!
See the further discussion above.

Kram's right, the 'hidden, institutional racism' is indeed 'everywhere'. And it indeed needs to be 'eradicated'... a whole lot to do there and it's not going to be easy.

I've previously described a holistic set of policy prescriptions that I think would make the biggest impact on concentrated intergenerational poverty vs a true opportunity society. Institutionalized racism being a key factor in why such policies have not been done to date.
User avatar
youthathletics
Posts: 14443
Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2018 7:36 pm

Re: It's Official - Mr. President, #46, Joe Biden

Post by youthathletics »

MDlaxfan76 wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 11:13 am
youthathletics wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 10:52 am
kramerica.inc wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 10:43 am
MDlaxfan76 wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 10:00 am
kramerica.inc wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 9:56 am
dislaxxic wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 8:25 am
old salt wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 6:57 amOur founders were geniuses. Too bad that American Exceptionalism is now interpreted as White Supremacy.
Salty may be talking about MagaNation's interpretion, wherein he MEANT to say "Too bad that American Exceptionalism is now interpreted as White Exceptionalism."

See, it's a latent kinda thing... :?

..
It's a latent thing by racist morons. Just like the response by the other side's prejudiced morons is equally stupid.

How long do the racist institutions have to be gone and torn down before the country stops making excuses? How long until we lose the victimhood?

Gonna be a while more, no? Because you and I both know that blaming the generations of oppression and accepting victimhood is easier than hard work, self betterment, and personal responsibility.

That's a personal choice, not an inherent one. People need to make the right choice. Just like a child of an alcoholic chooses to break a string of substance abuse.
Kram, do you truly believe there's one playing field for everyone?
No. I never said there was. There is certainly hidden, institutional racism everywhere. And those instances need to be eradicated whenever found.
But I also know that hard work and a persistent mindset and effort is stronger than any forces working against someone.
+1

MD, do you believe there ever will be a level playing field? Curious, can you provide a list of what is left to fix and how to conquer that list?
Long list!
See the further discussion above.

Kram's right, the 'hidden, institutional racism' is indeed 'everywhere'. And it indeed needs to be 'eradicated'... a whole lot to do there and it's not going to be easy.

I've previously described a holistic set of policy prescriptions that I think would make the biggest impact on concentrated intergenerational poverty vs a true opportunity society. Institutionalized racism being a key factor in why such policies have not been done to date.
:shock: you admitted someone was right, that is righty? ;)

The elephant in the room: How do we say "Mission Accomplished"? It seems anyone with white skin can not go there, so what next?
A fraudulent intent, however carefully concealed at the outset, will generally, in the end, betray itself.
~Livy
User avatar
Kismet
Posts: 4440
Joined: Sat Nov 02, 2019 6:42 pm

Re: It's Official - Mr. President, #46, Joe Biden

Post by Kismet »

kramerica.inc wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 10:43 am
MDlaxfan76 wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 10:00 am
kramerica.inc wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 9:56 am
dislaxxic wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 8:25 am
old salt wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 6:57 amOur founders were geniuses. Too bad that American Exceptionalism is now interpreted as White Supremacy.
Salty may be talking about MagaNation's interpretion, wherein he MEANT to say "Too bad that American Exceptionalism is now interpreted as White Exceptionalism."

See, it's a latent kinda thing... :?

..
It's a latent thing by racist morons. Just like the response by the other side's prejudiced morons is equally stupid.

How long do the racist institutions have to be gone and torn down before the country stops making excuses? How long until we lose the victimhood?

Gonna be a while more, no? Because you and I both know that blaming the generations of oppression and accepting victimhood is easier than hard work, self betterment, and personal responsibility.

That's a personal choice, not an inherent one. People need to make the right choice. Just like a child of an alcoholic chooses to break a string of substance abuse.
Kram, do you truly believe there's one playing field for everyone?
No. I never said there was. There is certainly hidden, institutional racism everywhere. And those instances need to be eradicated whenever found.
But I also know that hard work and a persistent mindset and effort is stronger than any forces working against someone.
I would agree with your premise. As an example, let's take the Founders of this country as an example. Certainly many of them were slaveholders and that they treated them as such to their everlasting shame on that one level. Those facts should not be forgotten nor embellished. But, as history also informs us, they were also men of wealth and stature who took a very big risk at the time which could have resulted not only in the loss of their fortunes but in their deaths on a gallows of revolution. As the last line of the Declaration reads:

“We Mutually Pledge To Each Other Our Lives, Our Fortunes, And Our Sacred Honor.”

It would be very helpful in the discussions we carry on today, if we practice less absolutism and employ more nuance and discretion when carrying it out.

In terms of the pandemic and the current mess we find ourselves in, perhaps we should take something inspirational from Thomas Paine (who is often so misinterpreted by some of the current rabble rousing crowd):

“These are the times that try men's souls. The summer soldier and the sunshine patriot will, in this crisis, shrink from the service of their country; but he that stands by it now, deserves the love and thanks of man and woman. Tyranny, like hell, is not easily conquered; yet we have this consolation with us, that the harder the conflict, the more glorious the triumph. What we obtain too cheap, we esteem too lightly: it is dearness only that gives every thing its value. Heaven knows how to put a proper price upon its goods; and it would be strange indeed if so celestial an article as FREEDOM should not be highly rated.”

and also of Washington who issued this proclamation to his command on the eve of his assault on the British at Trenton on Christmas Eve 1776 along with copies of Paine's pamphlet

“I call not upon a few, but upon all: not on this state or that state, but on every state: up and help us; lay your shoulders to the wheel; better have too much force than too little, when so great an object is at stake. Let it be told to the future world, that in the depth of winter, when nothing but hope and virtue could survive, that the city and the country, alarmed at one common danger, came forth to meet and to repulse it.”
User avatar
MDlaxfan76
Posts: 25756
Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2018 5:40 pm

Re: It's Official - Mr. President, #46, Joe Biden

Post by MDlaxfan76 »

On the positive side of this discussion, wow, a lot of talent and multi-cultural shift on display throughout the day and evening yesterday.

If one didn't get a thrill, a sense of immense hope and promise, from our 22yr old poet laureate, I don't know what to say...I'd recommend catching her interview with Andersen Cooper later in the evening post fireworks...she's even more impressive than just her genius and heart on display in her poetry.

A great example of Kram's "hard work and a persistent mindset and effort is stronger than any forces working against someone." who also met a community of people, yes 'a village' who supported and nurtured her in her journey to date.

My mom found Joe's carrying his great grandchild in his arms in the White House while watching the show on the big screen to be her favorite moment...
User avatar
MDlaxfan76
Posts: 25756
Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2018 5:40 pm

Re: It's Official - Mr. President, #46, Joe Biden

Post by MDlaxfan76 »

youthathletics wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 11:17 am
MDlaxfan76 wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 11:13 am
youthathletics wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 10:52 am
kramerica.inc wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 10:43 am
MDlaxfan76 wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 10:00 am
kramerica.inc wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 9:56 am
dislaxxic wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 8:25 am
old salt wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 6:57 amOur founders were geniuses. Too bad that American Exceptionalism is now interpreted as White Supremacy.
Salty may be talking about MagaNation's interpretion, wherein he MEANT to say "Too bad that American Exceptionalism is now interpreted as White Exceptionalism."

See, it's a latent kinda thing... :?

..
It's a latent thing by racist morons. Just like the response by the other side's prejudiced morons is equally stupid.

How long do the racist institutions have to be gone and torn down before the country stops making excuses? How long until we lose the victimhood?

Gonna be a while more, no? Because you and I both know that blaming the generations of oppression and accepting victimhood is easier than hard work, self betterment, and personal responsibility.

That's a personal choice, not an inherent one. People need to make the right choice. Just like a child of an alcoholic chooses to break a string of substance abuse.
Kram, do you truly believe there's one playing field for everyone?
No. I never said there was. There is certainly hidden, institutional racism everywhere. And those instances need to be eradicated whenever found.
But I also know that hard work and a persistent mindset and effort is stronger than any forces working against someone.
+1

MD, do you believe there ever will be a level playing field? Curious, can you provide a list of what is left to fix and how to conquer that list?
Long list!
See the further discussion above.

Kram's right, the 'hidden, institutional racism' is indeed 'everywhere'. And it indeed needs to be 'eradicated'... a whole lot to do there and it's not going to be easy.

I've previously described a holistic set of policy prescriptions that I think would make the biggest impact on concentrated intergenerational poverty vs a true opportunity society. Institutionalized racism being a key factor in why such policies have not been done to date.
:shock: you admitted someone was right, that is righty? ;)

The elephant in the room: How do we say "Mission Accomplished"? It seems anyone with white skin can not go there, so what next?
I'll come back to you on this youth, but I get accused, understandably, of being too longwinded as it is. ;)

But no, we are far from "Mission Accomplished".
And yeah, if you think that's the case, you just haven't been listening. White or not.

BTW, the bolded in red above is what true conservatives, at least traditionally, have wanted. It may be impossible to achieve perfectly, but directionally what we want to animate our society's forward momentum.
Last edited by MDlaxfan76 on Thu Jan 21, 2021 11:31 am, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
MDlaxfan76
Posts: 25756
Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2018 5:40 pm

Re: It's Official - Mr. President, #46, Joe Biden

Post by MDlaxfan76 »

Kismet wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 11:21 am
kramerica.inc wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 10:43 am
MDlaxfan76 wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 10:00 am
kramerica.inc wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 9:56 am
dislaxxic wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 8:25 am
old salt wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 6:57 amOur founders were geniuses. Too bad that American Exceptionalism is now interpreted as White Supremacy.
Salty may be talking about MagaNation's interpretion, wherein he MEANT to say "Too bad that American Exceptionalism is now interpreted as White Exceptionalism."

See, it's a latent kinda thing... :?

..
It's a latent thing by racist morons. Just like the response by the other side's prejudiced morons is equally stupid.

How long do the racist institutions have to be gone and torn down before the country stops making excuses? How long until we lose the victimhood?

Gonna be a while more, no? Because you and I both know that blaming the generations of oppression and accepting victimhood is easier than hard work, self betterment, and personal responsibility.

That's a personal choice, not an inherent one. People need to make the right choice. Just like a child of an alcoholic chooses to break a string of substance abuse.
Kram, do you truly believe there's one playing field for everyone?
No. I never said there was. There is certainly hidden, institutional racism everywhere. And those instances need to be eradicated whenever found.
But I also know that hard work and a persistent mindset and effort is stronger than any forces working against someone.
I would agree with your premise. As an example, let's take the Founders of this country as an example. Certainly many of them were slaveholders and that they treated them as such to their everlasting shame on that one level. Those facts should not be forgotten nor embellished. But, as history also informs us, they were also men of wealth and stature who took a very big risk at the time which could have resulted not only in the loss of their fortunes but in their deaths on a gallows of revolution. As the last line of the Declaration reads:

“We Mutually Pledge To Each Other Our Lives, Our Fortunes, And Our Sacred Honor.”

It would be very helpful in the discussions we carry on today, if we practice less absolutism and employ more nuance and discretion when carrying it out.

In terms of the pandemic and the current mess we find ourselves in, perhaps we should take something inspirational from Thomas Paine (who is often so misinterpreted by some of the current rabble rousing crowd):

“These are the times that try men's souls. The summer soldier and the sunshine patriot will, in this crisis, shrink from the service of their country; but he that stands by it now, deserves the love and thanks of man and woman. Tyranny, like hell, is not easily conquered; yet we have this consolation with us, that the harder the conflict, the more glorious the triumph. What we obtain too cheap, we esteem too lightly: it is dearness only that gives every thing its value. Heaven knows how to put a proper price upon its goods; and it would be strange indeed if so celestial an article as FREEDOM should not be highly rated.”

and also of Washington who issued this proclamation to his command on the eve of his assault on the British at Trenton on Christmas Eve 1776 along with copies of Paine's pamphlet

“I call not upon a few, but upon all: not on this state or that state, but on every state: up and help us; lay your shoulders to the wheel; better have too much force than too little, when so great an object is at stake. Let it be told to the future world, that in the depth of winter, when nothing but hope and virtue could survive, that the city and the country, alarmed at one common danger, came forth to meet and to repulse it.”
Thanks for the reminders. Moving.
ggait
Posts: 4073
Joined: Fri Aug 31, 2018 1:23 pm

Re: President Elect Biden

Post by ggait »

For laughs, I'd encourage you guys to go back to the beginning of this thread.

Joe has Alzheimers. Joe running for prez is elder abuse. Kamala (who'll be president any day now) is a fascist. And on and on.

This one is pretty good too:
Peter Brown wrote: Mon Sep 14, 2020 12:56 pm Let me know when you see gangs of marauding Republicans burning down stores, rioting, looting, suppressing speech, promoting "Cuties", and all the other obvious cultural degradations of the left.
Boycott stupid. If you ignore the gator troll, eventually he'll just go back under his bridge.
tech37
Posts: 4259
Joined: Tue Jul 31, 2018 7:02 pm

Re: It's Official - Mr. President, #46, Joe Biden

Post by tech37 »

MDlaxfan76 wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 11:05 am These are not "excuses", they are a persistent reality in our society, despite the progress made since Jim Crow.
On this auspicious occasion, I'm sort of agreeing with MDlax.

IMO, our society is dealing with the aftermath or consequences of both slavery and Jim Crow. It's sometimes difficult (or "hidden" as Kram said) to see it re institutions, but no doubt it's there. And I'm glad to see MD mention "progress" that obviously has been substantial since Jim Crow.

The problem is, people who gain power or want to, by using race as a tool to that end, want you to believe that there is rampant, overt racism everywhere in society, which again IMO, is just not accurate. It's a fear tactic that has divided the country. Sure there are overt racists, (on both sides of the race issue btw) but a very small percentage that are truly a problem in a country of 300+ million.

Should overt racists be dealt with? Well off course!... but not at the expense of the vast millions who don't exhibit/practice racist tendencies.
User avatar
MDlaxfan76
Posts: 25756
Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2018 5:40 pm

Re: It's Official - Mr. President, #46, Joe Biden

Post by MDlaxfan76 »

tech37 wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 12:00 pm
MDlaxfan76 wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 11:05 am These are not "excuses", they are a persistent reality in our society, despite the progress made since Jim Crow.
On this auspicious occasion, I'm sort of agreeing with MDlax.

IMO, our society is dealing with the aftermath or consequences of both slavery and Jim Crow. It's sometimes difficult (or "hidden" as Kram said) to see it re institutions, but no doubt it's there. And I'm glad to see MD mention "progress" that obviously has been substantial since Jim Crow.

The problem is, people who gain power or want to, by using race as a tool to that end, want you to believe that there is rampant, overt racism everywhere in society, which again IMO, is just not accurate. It's a fear tactic that has divided the country. Sure there are overt racists, (on both sides of the race issue btw) but a very small percentage that are truly a problem in a country of 300+ million.

Should overt racists be dealt with? Well off course!... but not at the expense of the vast millions who don't exhibit/practice racist tendencies.
Let's just say that we're close to agreement. "sort of"...And count that as a win for civil discourse. ;)

I think you underestimate the perniciousness of unrecognized, "hidden" bigotries that lead to the persistence of ongoing institutionalized racism and policies that support and perpetuate such systemic frictions for some.

A whole lot of us contribute to this, some unwittingly, some actively and angrily yet in denial, and yes, a smaller set of 'overt racists'... 'out' white supremacists.

In a true opportunity society, which I think should directionally be the goal, we reduce these systemic and intergenerational frictions to minimal, and by chance, not by predictable constraints on some because of their race, religion, gender, etc.

Yes, there are politicians on both ends of the spectrum who have used race to divide so as to achieve power or money or...but that shouldn't be, needn't be, confused with the honest recognition of the true, persistent realities of institutionalized racism. And that honest recognition should not be back burnered simply because it offends the sensibilities of the majority to be called out for their own complicity in the perpetuation of these systemic issues.

We can get there.
kramerica.inc
Posts: 6211
Joined: Sun Jul 29, 2018 9:01 pm

Re: It's Official - Mr. President, #46, Joe Biden

Post by kramerica.inc »

MDlaxfan76 wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 11:22 am On the positive side of this discussion, wow, a lot of talent and multi-cultural shift on display throughout the day and evening yesterday.

If one didn't get a thrill, a sense of immense hope and promise, from our 22yr old poet laureate, I don't know what to say...I'd recommend catching her interview with Andersen Cooper later in the evening post fireworks...she's even more impressive than just her genius and heart on display in her poetry.

A great example of Kram's "hard work and a persistent mindset and effort is stronger than any forces working against someone." who also met a community of people, yes 'a village' who supported and nurtured her in her journey to date.
If you aren't buoyed by the impressiveness of this country's makeup and the promise of future generations than you're missing out. Lots of unharnessed potential for greatness.
a fan
Posts: 17723
Joined: Mon Aug 06, 2018 9:05 pm

Re: It's Official - Mr. President, #46, Joe Biden

Post by a fan »

tech37 wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 12:00 pmThe problem is, people who gain power or want to, by using race as a tool to that end, want you to believe that there is rampant, overt racism everywhere in society, which again IMO, is just not accurate.
This is true.

The recent problem, imho, is when an entire nation of Republicans (yeah, I know, I'm pointing out a party, but what do you want me to do here?) who just told Black Lives Matters in Minneapolis that not only is there not a problem with a Democract-Party managed city? But that there are no management problems in any major city in the United States.

And when millions of people tell black Americans that they are INSANE if they think that SOME-----not all-----cities have some institutional racism built into their policing.

This was the BIGGEST opportunity for the Republican party for the last 40 years. Dem leadership is CLEARLY failing in cities like Minneapolis. And what was the Republican party's reaction to this news? Did they say "we freaking told you that the Dems suck. We're here to listen, and help to fix these problems. Let's meet and hear your concerns"?

Nope. What did they do instead? They spent all their time and energy talking about violence and property destruction.

Horrible, horrible missed opportunity. Not just for the R party, but for the welfare of America as a whole. All they had to do was listen, and then act.


But my point is: when your fellow black citizens tell their fellow Americans that their Dem-run governments are killing them because of *hit management...and the reaction of millions is "I don't believe you"? What message do you think is received by black Americans as to how many racists there are in America?



And speaking of you not believing that I liked some of Trump's policies? Trump sent in Federal agents to Chicago and other cities to help tackle the gun violence---Operation Legend. I was OVERJOYED to see him actually step up to try and help----something Obama nor Bush did. THAT sent the message that Republicans are listening.

The Feds posted an update in September-----a whole mess of Federal arrests. I hope Biden doubles down on the program, but I'm not holding my breath.

https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/operatio ... al-charges
jhu72
Posts: 13883
Joined: Wed Sep 19, 2018 12:52 pm

Re: It's Official - Mr. President, #46, Joe Biden

Post by jhu72 »

seacoaster wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 10:14 am
DMac wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 9:54 am Wow, you boys are brutal, this doesn't sound/feel like coming together, unity, and healing to me. salty did say what he says he said, I remember. seacoaster said pretty much the same in that our institutions were set up so as to be able to handle a disaster the likes of Trump and they did. I had my doubts but they were right. The people saying the healing and coming together is going to take a long time (Trump's funk aint going away anytime soon) are right too, you can see that here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=45cYwDMibGo
TLD wrote:
"I thought Festivus was last month."
:lol: :lol:
Yes, Old Salt did say that, but I think his faith in those institutions was greater than mine. The systems of checks and balances worked badly -- if sufficiently for survival -- in the Trump years. And that was because of fidelity to party. One legacy of the Trump years is that it could happen here: we can see a roadmap for bringing one's party to heel; ensuring that the demagogue's party members in Congress effectively fail to exercise any restraining influence or power out of fear for their jobs; warping the institutions by bypassing Congress with "acting" cabinet secretaries, etc. In the end, I am grateful for the Constitution, but understand that a smarter person than Trump could have overcome it and those institutional and legal restraints. Post-truth in pre-fascist, and we should never forget it.
It was a very near thing. I did not think Trump could do as much damage as he did. I expected more of the nations leaders (specifically republican). They let us down. But for the little people working in government, we would have failed the challenge.

It is certainly true that it was fortunate that Trump had so many flaws, he was easily distracted. A more determined, focused and smarter individual might have succeeded. That 40% of the populous still don't seem to understand what he was or supported his racism is very disappointing.
Image STAND AGAINST FASCISM
kramerica.inc
Posts: 6211
Joined: Sun Jul 29, 2018 9:01 pm

Re: It's Official - Mr. President, #46, Joe Biden

Post by kramerica.inc »

DMac wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 9:54 am Wow, you boys are brutal, this doesn't sound/feel like coming together, unity, and healing to me. salty did say what he says he said, I remember. seacoaster said pretty much the same in that our institutions were set up so as to be able to handle a disaster the likes of Trump and they did. I had my doubts but they were right. The people saying the healing and coming together is going to take a long time (Trump's funk aint going away anytime soon) are right too, you can see that here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=45cYwDMibGo
TLD wrote:
"I thought Festivus was last month."
:lol: :lol:
Trump didn't unify. He straight up divided. Barack Obama and Biden promised unity, and what they really meant was "let us ram through Leftist policy priorities, overrun executive limitations, and build a coalition around identity politics, and if you don't like it, you're probably a bigot."

So hopeful this will be REAL unity...this time.
Post Reply

Return to “POLITICS”