NCAC 2020

D3 Mens Lacrosse
Nosey Ned
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Re: NCAC 2020

Post by Nosey Ned »

MrLax2U wrote: Sun Feb 16, 2020 9:37 pm Ned,
I surfed both the Big Red/W&L and Rhodes/IWU games today. As per my post on the D 3 POLL Blog I moved Denison up right behind Salisbury/RIT and ranked Rhodes #10 for which I've already gotten some flac. We'll see but both Rhodes and IWU are upcoming programs and deserve a Shout Out for their efforts.

Can you give me some color on how the Denison players feel about playing in the Mustang Classic? Berkman won't go there and were it a positive experience (given social media among the participants) I don't think the Gull players are putting any pressure on him to join in.
I commend you for wanting to acknowledge the advancement in programs like IWU and Rhodes but I have got to respectfully disagree with Rhodes as a Top 10 team. I had a quick look and they have only played “nationally relevant” teams 4 times in their history and are 0-4. I think they need to beat some top teams at least a couple times before they can enter the rarified air of the Top 10. Could I see a #20 ranking? I wouldn’t push back on that ... that in and of itself would be a nod to their progress and be a tremendous shot in the arm for the program as well as the conference. And besides let’s wait to see how they do the 5th time ... when they play Salisbury. If they’re more than competitive for 60 minutes then we can talk about a higher ranking. But I have a feeling they aren’t there yet.

Now as for the Mustang Classic, I have never heard any DU player say anything negative about that tournament! I’m surprised to hear that team members on other teams may have... but then again I’m not a social media maven so things would easily slip right by me on that “highway”! Haha. As for Denison’s participation, I have to believe it’s supported 100% from the players, the coaches, the Administration, the Alumni and the parents! Keep in mind for Denison the Mustang is part of a 10 day minimum, Spring break road trip to the East Coast. After the Classic the team works their way down to Va area and plays an OOC game in the Charlottesville area the following Saturday. The cost of taking 48 players and staff (buses, hotels, meals etc) is huge and could not be done without the full support of all those groups mentioned. This trip is central to the Denison lax experience. Being from the Midwest it’s an opportunity to get exposure on the East Coast and also gives players a chance to play closer to home in front of friends and family. The vast majority of the players on the Big Red are from the East Coast in general and from the Middle Atlantic area specifically. That week is a great team bonding trip with more then a few meals served with family and friends in a local restaurant or quite often the home of one of the players in the area. From my vantage point .. it’s a highlight of the season.
Understandably Salisbury wouldn’t have the same needs of East Coast exposure but for DU, playing in the NCAC as you’ve pointed out, it’s easy to get overlooked and this trip allows the Big Red to showcase their talent in front of people who otherwise wouldn’t have an opportunity to see them. One could argue it comes too early in the season because they go back to Ohio and run through the conference and some of the talking heads forget how they faired on this trip against quality opponents... which historically has been very good. But hey ... I digress, that’s a topic for perhaps another day.
ergit
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Re: NCAC 2020

Post by ergit »

oldtimelax wrote: Sun Feb 16, 2020 2:53 pm Agreed, Denison looks very, very good out of the gate. OWU got handled by RIT. After hanging close in the 1Q, the dam broke and the Tigers went up 9-2 at the half and cruised to a 17-4 thrashing. Lots of problems for the Bishops with face-offs and clears. Offense looked anemic with no outside shooting threat and only 13 total shots (Max Tennant alone took that many in most games). Sichenza actually looked pretty solid, making 17 saves. It was bitter cold (24 degrees and in the teens with the wind chill) but the Bishops probably caught a break as the Tigers were not as sharp with some of their passes. Bishops don't have much depth and could easily be challenged by Kenyon, Wittenberg and Wooster this year. Next four will be interesting (IWU, St. Vincent, Elmhurst and Westminster) to see if Plantholt can get something going before they face the Salisbury Gulls.
From what I saw, OWU looked like a younger, more inexperienced team and were a bit man-handled because of it. Lost the ground ball battle and clearing was a problem. These are the hallmarks of inexperience and will improve with experience and coaching. If OWU can keep recruiting the players (an open question), the coaching should take care of the rest.
The OWU goalie played great and made a ton of really legit saves on a high volume of shots. I was impressed.
lordslaxfan
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Joined: Wed Mar 13, 2019 11:25 am

Re: NCAC 2020

Post by lordslaxfan »

I am pretty happy with Kenyon’s first two games. They took care of business and beat the teams that they were supposed to beat.

It looks like they will end up in the NCAC playoffs again, but these two wins do not tell us more than that.
oldtimelax
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Re: NCAC 2020

Post by oldtimelax »

Kenyon has six games before they face OWU to start their NCAC season -- four should be W's, B-W is a toss-up, and Roanoke will be a measuring stick game to see how far they have come. Kenyon-OWU will be a very close game this year -- talent is even, and coaching will be the difference.
Nosey Ned
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Joined: Thu Apr 11, 2019 10:13 am

Re: NCAC 2020

Post by Nosey Ned »

I posted this in the Scores thread but just as relevant here, probably more so....
.

Probably not on anyone's radar (why would it be) but I was surprised that Allegheny, playing their first varsity lacrosse game, lost to Baldwin Wallace by only 2 goals. ... 7-9! Vegas probably would have had this a 10-12 goal margin, easy!
Looks like it was played in a snow storm - but nonetheless a big pleasant surprise IMHO.

Congratulations to Coach Pearce in his teams inaugural game! Great result for a roster with 21 first years; 3 sophomores; and 1 junior and 1 senior playing a seasoned 8 year old program that was picked 3rd in the OAC.

If this is any indication, I dare say Allegheny might just win more than a few NCAC games this year - the bottom third of the conference could be bested by an upstart! And I think the top of the conference would welcome the prospect of them becoming real competition in hopefully just a few short years!
FannOLax
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Re: NCAC 2020

Post by FannOLax »

You're right, Ned. Allegheny has hired a good head coach, who was a D3 head coach in Maryland. Interesting that the team also has a road trip to Maryland to play McDaniel and to Virginia to play Shenandoah of the ODAC; so it looks like the college is giving the program adequate support. Could end up being good for the NCAC.
https://alleghenygators.com/sports/mens ... e/schedule
lordslaxfan
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Re: NCAC 2020

Post by lordslaxfan »

I hope you are right. The Conference will improve a lot when the bottom 3rd becomes respectable.
JBFortunato
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Re: NCAC 2020

Post by JBFortunato »

lordslaxfan wrote: Fri Feb 28, 2020 8:11 am I hope you are right. The Conference will improve a lot when the bottom 3rd becomes respectable.
I know a kid who put his name in the transfer portal at the end of the first semester of this year, and the very first coach to reach out to him was the Allegheny coach. He's trying hard, and it's a school with rigorous academics, so they've got a shot to get there.
grelch
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Re: NCAC 2020

Post by grelch »

OWU lose to a winless Elmhurst. That has to sting even if it is a rebuilding year.
Nosey Ned
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Re: NCAC 2020

Post by Nosey Ned »

grelch wrote: Sat Feb 29, 2020 5:40 pm OWU lose to a winless Elmhurst. That has to sting even if it is a rebuilding year.
I think IL may have the score backwards.... wouldn’t be the first time. When I saw it I said “that can’t be true .... can it?!” So I checked the OWU website ... they have the Bishops winning by that same 14-10 score. That would have been tough one for sure!!
grelch
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Re: NCAC 2020

Post by grelch »

Yep. Just saw on twitter that OWU won. IL has it wrong on the D# board as well as both of the team's pages.
oldtimelax
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Re: NCAC 2020

Post by oldtimelax »

Yesterday was a good win for the Bishops against a decent Elmhurst squad that has a talented core of players but is also struggling to find some consistency. OWU's offense is starting to come together as the first midfield scored 8 goals and the attack added five goals and four assists. Sichenza in goal remains solid and the close defense, LSM and SSDM are starting to gel -- at least in settled situations. Clears and turnovers are still the major fix, but the Bishops had far fewer penalties. The Bishops still lack a true FOGO, but did a nice job using their long sticks and negating most fast breaks off the draw and winning 17 of 28.

While RIT was a wipe-out, the biggest hit to their fragile confidence came last week during an inexplicable 20 minute collapse, where the Bishops gave up ten straight goals and their offense went dormant in the third and fourth quarters to Ill. Wesleyan, and turned a 8-4 lead into a 14-11 loss. Too bad St. Vincent got snowed out but the Bishops have a Tuesday date with Westminster (Pa.) before the daunting task of taking on Salisbury in their annual match, played this year at the Lacrosse Hall of Fame next Sunday in Sparks, MD.
Nosey Ned
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Re: NCAC 2020

Post by Nosey Ned »

oldtimelax wrote: Sun Mar 01, 2020 11:58 am Yesterday was a good win for the Bishops against a decent Elmhurst squad that has a talented core of players but is also struggling to find some consistency.
I think not long ago the measuring stick for OWU would not have been Elmhurst. No disrespect meant to the Bluejays but they were 0-3 coming into this game and a 4 goal win for the Bishops is ... just that, a win. Which OWU did need.... and any win’s a good win at this point.

With that in mind, the Big Red got a win today and so that was good ... but thank goodness they seemed to wake up in the 4th Q - going on an 8-0 run to break open a game that was surprisingly tied after 3 Qs. Hats off to the Roanoke goalie #1 for keeping the Maroon’s in the game in the 1st and 3rd Qs by making 12 saves combined in those 2 Qs. Not sure why they went to another goalie in the 2nd Q .... anybody knows what was up with that?

The Big Red won all the statistics by a wide margin so it probably was just a matter of time before the dam broke, which it did in the 4th. Roanoke scored 2 last minute goals to make a 13-5 deficit a little more respectable.

Anyway a win is a win ... they aren’t all masterpieces but you take it and move on to the next opponent!
oldtimelax
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Re: NCAC 2020

Post by oldtimelax »

This week in NCAC....7 of 10 are winners....some interesting scores, especially Wooster and Wittenberg. Congrats to Allegheny getting first program win. I predict they finish ahead of both Hiram and Wabash and will be competitive with DePauw and Oberlin.

Kenyon 16, Sewanee 5 -- Lords are 3-0 on easy early schedule
Denison 13, Roanoke 7 -- Big Red are on cruise control, rolling right into the Green Turtle Classic in two weeks
OWU 14, Elmhurst 10 -- Bishops get a W and a breather on Tuesday vs. Westminster before facing Salisbury next Sunday.
Wittenberg 21, Transylvania 8 -- Wittenberg wins big but has lost to Otterbein and John Carroll.
Oberlin 12, Albion 11-- Oberlin beats a team that beat Elmhurst (12-5) and Augustana (17-11) but lost to Otterbein.
Wooster 17, Otterbein 3 -- Wooster clobbers Otterbein, has Capital and John Carroll this week.
Alleghany 18, Heidelberg 8 -- Gators gets first program win after close loss to a good B-W squad. Face Mt. Union next.
Capital 14, DePauw 11 -- Tigers are 0-3 and face Transylvania and Denison this week
Monmouth 18, Wabash 6 -- Not an encouraging start
Adrian 14, Hiram 3 -- Terriers lose their first one, after two wins over Franciscan and LaRoche.
oldtimelax
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Re: NCAC 2020

Post by oldtimelax »

Nosey Ned wrote: Sun Mar 01, 2020 3:37 pm
oldtimelax wrote: Sun Mar 01, 2020 11:58 am Yesterday was a good win for the Bishops against a decent Elmhurst squad that has a talented core of players but is also struggling to find some consistency.
I think not long ago the measuring stick for OWU would not have been Elmhurst. No disrespect meant to the Bluejays but they were 0-3 coming into this game and a 4 goal win for the Bishops is ... just that, a win. Which OWU did need.... and any win’s a good win at this point.

With that in mind, the Big Red got a win today and so that was good ... but thank goodness they seemed to wake up in the 4th Q - going on an 8-0 run to break open a game that was surprisingly tied after 3 Qs. Hats off to the Roanoke goalie #1 for keeping the Maroon’s in the game in the 1st and 3rd Qs by making 12 saves combined in those 2 Qs. Not sure why they went to another goalie in the 2nd Q .... anybody knows what was up with that?

The Big Red won all the statistics by a wide margin so it probably was just a matter of time before the dam broke, which it did in the 4th. Roanoke scored 2 last minute goals to make a 13-5 deficit a little more respectable.

Anyway a win is a win ... they aren’t all masterpieces but you take it and move on to the next opponent!
Yes a win is win. But Roanoke isn't that good....they lost to Christopher Newport by 12 and beat a Sewanee team by 8 that Kenyon just beat by 11. Also the win over W&L doesn't seem so great since they are 1-3 and lost to F&M by 10 on Saturday.
Nosey Ned
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Re: NCAC 2020

Post by Nosey Ned »

True, it probably is a down year for Roanoke. Denison outplayed them start to finish and in every statistical category and if it weren't for their goalie play ... the score would have more correctly reflected the difference in level of play. Denison went up by 8 with ~5 minutes left and emptied the bench ... Roanoke got 2 in the last minute to cut it to 6. But Roanoke is a proud program (like OWU) and they aren't going to just lay down after 2 sub par performances to start the year. Teams get better.

And I'm not sure what your point is with sighting comparative scores .. 8 goals vs 12 goals vs 6 goals. What does it matter? Lots of factors come into play on goal differential on any given day.... today was their goalie.

You seem a little testy Oldtime ... if you have a problem with W&Ls ranking take it up on that thread. Denison is just going through the schedule that's in front of them to get ready for the game (and most likely rematch) that really matter.
Cnoll
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Re: NCAC 2020

Post by Cnoll »

After watching the first two games online and then watching Denison in person today, it is obvious the Big Red are not a top ten team right now, in spite of their ranking. Defense is a little better than average. Offense, not so much, too much individual play. My prediction is that they will lose one or both games at The Mustang Classic.
oldtimelax
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Re: NCAC 2020

Post by oldtimelax »

Not being testy, Ned just saying that Big Red's 3-0 start and #7 rating may not look as awesome since W&L (picked by many to be a top 20 team) is 1-3 and Roanoke is 1-2. I have watched all three of Denison's games this season and I do think they look very good, in fact, the NCAC should be a cake walk for them this season.
Nosey Ned
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Re: NCAC 2020

Post by Nosey Ned »

Cnoll wrote: Sun Mar 01, 2020 6:11 pm After watching the first two games online and then watching Denison in person today, it is obvious the Big Red are not a top ten team right now, in spite of their ranking. Defense is a little better than average. Offense, not so much, too much individual play. My prediction is that they will lose one or both games at The Mustang Classic.
Cnoll ... I know we're both Big Red fans but I've noticed we typically come at it from different perspectives. I'm glass half full ... you're glass half empty. And that's ok - if you split the difference between us, that's probably where you'll find the truth!

I think the defense is better than that. I think they are very good! And the offense has had to go to individual players beating the man in front of them because defenses are game planning to stop #18 by shutting him off or playing zone. Or if teams are going to purposely slide late and put a smallish ssdm on #31, I want to see him try and run through that all day. Or if guys can get a step on their defender from X and hit the near corner ... I have no problem with that. Ball movement will be there when defenses play man to man. At least that's how I see it.
DU will find it harder to break down zone without the #11 and #2 hitting from the outside but hey, it's early and you've got to give this offense a chance to hit it's full stride.
Nosey Ned
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Re: NCAC 2020

Post by Nosey Ned »

oldtimelax wrote: Sun Mar 01, 2020 6:15 pm Not being testy, Ned just saying that Big Red's 3-0 start and #7 rating may not look as awesome since W&L (picked by many to be a top 20 team) is 1-3 and Roanoke is 1-2. I have watched all three of Denison's games this season and I do think they look very good, in fact, the NCAC should be a cake walk for them this season.
I expect the OWU game to be the battle it always is. The end of April is long way off. Neither team will be the same as they are now come season's end!
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