D3 Men Rankings

D3 Mens Lacrosse
ergit
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Re: Top 20 Ranking D3

Post by ergit »

And sorry, Trinity doesn’t make the list... ;)
richard
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Re: Top 20 Ranking D3

Post by richard »

The only outlier, and just because I like their defense is Lynchburg.
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admin
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Re: Top 20 Ranking D3

Post by admin »

I doubt you would've said Wesleyan this time last season.
richard
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Re: Top 20 Ranking D3

Post by richard »

admin wrote: Tue Apr 09, 2019 5:55 pm I doubt you would've said Wesleyan this time last season.
Right on that. RIT looked unbeatable. I also didn't think Salisbury would get anywhere either.
ah23
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Re: D3 Men Rankings

Post by ah23 »

Tigerlax70 wrote: Mon Apr 08, 2019 5:30 pm
admin wrote: Mon Apr 08, 2019 12:28 pm Best Ws, Worst Ls is not twisted logic. Williams may very well not be the best team in D3 lacrosse, but based on their Ws over Amherst, Bates, and Union and their only losses being vs. Wesleyan and Tufts, they have the best resume. So, Salisbury may be better than Williams but, even with no losses, their Ws over Cabrini, Gettysburg, and Lynchburg are not as impressive.

Trinity would win the LL easy?!
This final statement is a misprint, right? If not, back off the bong. I can only surmise that you were thinking of another league. A certain team in Rochester, NY might question your logic. Even fellow members of the NESCAC who I greatly admire and who deserve all the accolades they get would find your statement laughable. Just for comparison purposes, Trinity lost to Bates 20-19 while RIT beat Bates on the road 14-12. You probably used the same logic the USILA Coaches Poll used to jump Tufts over RIT this week. While Tufts was losing it’s first game this week, RIT defeated Cortland by the same margin of victory as Tufts and absolutely annihilated #15 RPI 22-13 (it was 19-6 at one point in the second half) and RPI’s starters scored 7 goals in garbage time. What more does a team need to do to hold their position? Tufts may very well be a better team than RIT, but Trinity? I think not. Please enlighten me on what criteria you used when formulating your claim that Trinity would win the Liberty League easily?
Saying Trinity would win the Liberty League is almost as ridiculous as using the transitive property to compare teams. That's the kind of stuff you hear from middle schoolers.

Also, RIT didn't beat Bates "on the road". They beat them at a neutral site.
ergit
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Re: Top 20 Ranking D3

Post by ergit »

Wesleyan made semi’s in 2017 and lost to RIT. It wasn’t a surprise last year that they made the semi’s again and went on to win the NC.
richard
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Re: Top 20 Ranking D3

Post by richard »

22-9 wouldn't give me much confidence.
COGULL
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Re: Top 20 Ranking D3

Post by COGULL »

So, I'm interested... Do you posters buy into Salisbury ranking 6th in the poll - If so, let me know how you're coming to your conclusion.
ah23
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Re: Top 20 Ranking D3

Post by ah23 »

ergit wrote: Mon Apr 08, 2019 1:12 pm Dropping Amherst and Tufts to #5 and #6 behind York is a little harsh but I guess it’s a case of ‘what have you done for me lately’.
Taking an early or mid-season loss is not the end of the world and good teams will learn from it.
I don't understand the polls at all, and I haven't for much of this season. Two-loss Wesleyan ahead of a one-loss Amherst team that beat them by five goals? Amherst ranked four spots below an RIT team with an identical record that they beat? Tufts as the third-best team in the NESCAC after a one-goal road loss to the defending national champions?

There are also some teams in the middle/end who have no business being ranked. The teams from #14-20 are a combined 4-14 against currently-ranked opponents, and one of those four wins came against a Christopher Newport team that has no business being ranked in the first place.

- #14 Dickinson (lost to Cabrini, beat Denison) has faced two. Dickinson has also lost twice to sub-.500 teams: a thorough handling by a 5-6 Middlebury team that is barely treading water in the NESCAC and hasn't been competitive in years, and a loss to a 4-7 Haverford team that has been blown out by every other legitimate team they have faced. I don't know how you can lose multiple games to bad teams and still get votes.
- #15 F&M has faced four ranked opponents and are 2-2 (plus a loss to Lynchburg). They deserve this spot.
- #16 RPI has faced two ranked opponents and has been blown off the field each time: by 9 against both RIT and Williams.
- #17 Union has only faced one ranked team: a loss to Williams. They do have some wins by large margins against decent opponents. At least they beat Middlebury.
- #18 W&L is 1-4 against ranked opponents, and the win is against Christopher Newport who should not be ranked.
- #19 St. Lawrence hasn't faced a single ranked team all year, and as far as I can tell hasn't beaten even a single relevant team. They are perhaps the most undeserving team in the rankings.
- #20 Christopher Newport is 0-4 against ranked teams and for good measure threw in an unranked loss for their fifth L of the season. I am not sure how this team is appreciably better than, say, Trinity (mentioned in earlier posts), who is 0-4 against teams ranked in the top 12 and has beaten everybody else.

With the exception of F&M, the rest of those teams have built up nice records largely by sifting through the garbage each week. I don't know who would be a better fit. Lynchburg certainly has a case. Stevenson does not. Ithaca...maybe? I can only assume that DeSales and Stockton's votes come from their respective coaches taking hostages. There will of course be more clarity as the season goes on (and the ranked LL teams have to face each other/get mauled by RIT), but right now I would anticipate a top-15 NESCAC team (most likely Williams or Bates) being left at home while some undeserving patsy makes the NCAA tournament.
FannOLax
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Re: Top 20 Ranking D3

Post by FannOLax »

COGULL wrote: Tue Apr 09, 2019 9:10 pm So, I'm interested... Do you posters buy into Salisbury ranking 6th in the poll - If so, let me know how you're coming to your conclusion.
I'd have an easier time putting Salisbury at #1 than #6; but I can also see putting a NESCAC team or two above the Gulls... so I'd say Salisbury no worse than #3, but I also have no problem with Salisbury #1 until the hypothetical day when somebody beats them.
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admin
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Re: Top 20 Ranking D3

Post by admin »

1. You can't build Rankings on head-to-head performance. Inevitably, you'll end up chasing your tail.
2. If you lose to #1, #2, #3, and #4, this doesn't mean your team stinks. It means your team is #5 or worse.
3. You can be 1-9 with a win over #11 and loses to #1 through #9 and be the #10 team in the country.

This explains the rankings. In a word, the Rankings are based off of "Best Wins" as well as Losses with Bad Losses being punishing and Good Losses (i.e. Losses to teams equal to or better than you) being less punishing.
palaxoff
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Re: Top 20 Ranking D3

Post by palaxoff »

Anyone know where you can find D3 Strength of Schedule stats and RPI ? Unfortunately the disparity in D3 makes it hard really dial in as well as D 1
bmorelax
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Re: Top 20 Ranking D3

Post by bmorelax »

Massey does a good job.

https://www.masseyratings.com/clax2019/ncaa-d3/ratings

Also Laxbytes

laxbytes.com/2019/binmenstats/rating03.php
Last edited by bmorelax on Wed Apr 10, 2019 10:48 am, edited 1 time in total.
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admin
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Re: Top 20 Ranking D3

Post by admin »

wow. alvernia 4 - stevenson 33.
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admin
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Re: Top 20 Ranking D3

Post by admin »

Massey?! What the... There's no Massey! Nah, just kidding. It looks pretty good. Though the ends are less interesting to me than the means. Obviously the ends need to make sense but my interest is a Ranking that makes sense. I feel like rankings are like lining a field without a string and 90 degree angler. You do it and it looks perfect and everyone agrees. and then someone gets in a helicopter and is like, holy crow! Our eyes trick us. Our prejudices trick us. And, biggest of all, group think tricks us. It's not a coincidence that so many rankings look so similar. and it's not necessarily because they're all right. anyway. you didn't ask so i'll stop.
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admin
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Re: Top 20 Ranking D3

Post by admin »

and, with that said...

D3 MEN: The Big Wins yesterday, in order, were Wesleyan beating Trinity, Denison beat Kenyon, Middlebury beat Springfield, and... FanLax has updated the Computer Rankings and Game Scores.
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admin
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Re: Top 20 Ranking D3

Post by admin »

Image

D3 MEN: Today's Big Games (in order of Bigness):

RIT vs. Ithaca
Salisbury vs. Christopher Newport
Gettysburg vs. Dickinson
York vs. Frostburg
Colby vs. Bowdoin
Washington vs. Haverford
richard
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Re: Top 20 Ranking D3

Post by richard »

Maybe not within the parameters of the fanlax rankings but the SLU Clarkson game is a big one. Clarkson is better than the ranking it has. That and the rivalry with SLU make it a game to watch. SLU needs to get out of the gate today or else things could go up in smoke.
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admin
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Re: Top 20 Ranking D3

Post by admin »

richard wrote: Wed Apr 10, 2019 1:18 pmThat and the rivalry with SLU make it a game to watch.
The computer lacks sentimentality.
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Fast Break
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Re: Top 20 Ranking D3

Post by Fast Break »

richard wrote: Wed Apr 10, 2019 1:18 pm Maybe not within the parameters of the fanlax rankings but the SLU Clarkson game is a big one. Clarkson is better than the ranking it has. That and the rivalry with SLU make it a game to watch. SLU needs to get out of the gate today or else things could go up in smoke.
I agree, very strong rivalry between two North Country neighbors. I hope that you are right, but maybe for an outcome different than you desire. ;)

Don't put the cold weather gear away...Game time Temp expected in the mid 20's.
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