Washington College 2019

D3 Mens Lacrosse
WASHFAN
Posts: 68
Joined: Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:14 am

Re: Washington College 2019

Post by WASHFAN »

Okay, not to put words in anyone’s mouth/post seems the consensus on advice seems to be:
1. Player Development on a program wide basis, with focus on summer ball workouts etc.
2. Fire up out of area/emerging hotbed recruitment
3. I’m checking on true price to attend but it seems that the “sticker” is 60ish with most students getting 20-25 off, so 35-40 ish, based on internet info..

Did I miss or misstate anything? I would comment on the Dickinson game but I’m sounding like a broken record...says my wife,,
mdline
Posts: 30
Joined: Fri Dec 21, 2018 3:24 pm

Re: Washington College 2019

Post by mdline »

Any number of ways to spin this, but success within any given program is based on the following:
- ability to attract 'talent' - gritty, athletic kids who love the game and want to work at it
- facilitation of a year long program that develops players individually and as a cohort
- game day planning and execution

I don't know how WAC compares to conference foes currently. The team has been 'in' the game with nearly every opponent this year but is coming out on the wrong end far more often than not. I'm sure that no one wants to reverse that trend more than the coaching staff and players.
Buzzard05
Posts: 5
Joined: Fri Mar 22, 2019 7:01 am

Re: Washington College 2019

Post by Buzzard05 »

It's not just the sticker price to attend, but how does WAC compare to its rivals in terms of the financial aid packages being offered. Pretty much all of the private colleges are in the 55K to 60K range for the full cost of attendance....but what are they giving the potential lacrosse players in terms of financial aid? If G-burg, Salisbury, etc. are offering more aid and the overall net price is cheaper to go there than WAC...my guess is a talented player faced with having multiple choices to go play in college is going to choose the cheaper option (or their parents will "assist" in that choice).
LaxPundit07
Posts: 671
Joined: Mon Mar 18, 2019 3:34 pm

Re: Washington College 2019

Post by LaxPundit07 »

It doesn't help that there has been a revolving door of presidents at WAC over the past 10-15 years.

Since 2004:
Baird Tipson (openly shared his disdain for lacrosse---couldn't believe people let their children play "that barbaric sport". Just a reminder, Baird, you can thank that "barbaric sport" for creating an identity and prominent alumni base at your institution. You may dislike it, but it is what WAC is. That would be like going to Notre Dame as prez and musing against football, or leading Duke and hating basketball. Dude, figure it out!)
Mitchell Reiss (openly shared his disdain for Chestertown. He openly shared his displeasure with the small town to his top aide, who happened to be a WAC alum. Doesn't seem like he was too concerned with hiding it.)
Jack S Griswold (Interim)
Sheila Bair (more concerned with being on CNBC every other day than running the college. ONE member of executive team is still on campus from when she started. Thanks for cleaning house of our tradition!)
Kurt Landgraf (#2 choice for President when Bair was hired. Should have been hired in the first place. Lucky to have him now--maybe, time will tell---but is damage too irrepairable?)

What does this mean for WAC? It means we are struggling with our identity. It also means we are in financial trouble---President Landgraf has made no secret of this in alumni communications.

None of the above is a recipe for success when it comes to recruiting kids to an expensive institution. Sure, a lot of the team's performance falls at the feet of the coaching staff, but NONE of the above helps them.
WestCoast3311
Posts: 4
Joined: Tue Feb 26, 2019 7:16 pm

Re: Washington College 2019

Post by WestCoast3311 »

Agree 100% on the leadership of the school being a driving force behind the programs downfall. Tipson wanted to cancel a season when there was a small hazing situation- fired JB- and left Shirk handcuffed in his first year.

With the pricepoint, competitive landscape and recent success tough times ahead unless they double down on athletics. Alumni want success and the $$ is there if the school will allow it. Look @ Stevenson as a prime example of sports and growth @ the school.
WASHFAN
Posts: 68
Joined: Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:14 am

Re: Washington College 2019

Post by WASHFAN »

Westcoast and Laxpundit I hear you loud and clear. Ive heard that Landgraff is a big step up (but given the history mentioned in your posts that’s not too hard). Do you understand this to be the case? Also another honest question: how do you best “Double Down” on Lax and Athletics? One parting shot: could the ADs make the case by recruiting some out of area, they are growing the schools footprint and brand to many more potential applicants? Sorry to run on...
COGULL
Posts: 103
Joined: Sun Feb 10, 2019 1:34 pm

Re: Washington College 2019

Post by COGULL »

Hoping WAC gains traction- I'm a Gulls fan but would really like to see all the fans from both sides get back to embracing the event & tradition that is the War on the Shore. Nothing builds a following like a great rivalry and some consistent success. Hard to believe anybody hates lacrosse - let alone an administration with an active program.
laxfan0165
Posts: 7
Joined: Wed Mar 20, 2019 4:41 pm

Re: Washington College 2019

Post by laxfan0165 »

Not a lot of good to be taken from that game! Outshot 54-33 with 24 turnovers. Worst losing streak since 2010. Something has to change in CTown.
WASHFAN
Posts: 68
Joined: Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:14 am

Re: Washington College 2019

Post by WASHFAN »

I’ll try to be constructive: F/O Man, Check. Goalie 11 of 20, check, we had a decent ride, EMO bad, Defense...hear you on the shots but with only 22 oncage...I’m not that freaked out...their big 3 are generally 35% shooters with low 60s SOG, we held them to 24% and 40% so we were doing something right, we continue not be physical and do not cause turnovers, Gittelman seems to be a bright spot, Offensive Turnovers are an abomination, several unforced, their net turnover -6, ours -21..even with Parks F/O advantage we are giving them the ball for 10-11 more possessions. A ranked Centennial team will hurt you when you give them the ball that many times. We aren’t dodging up top effectively and we are not protecting the ball...I don’t know why Cooper Sloan disappeared in 2nd half but it could have made a difference...another winnable game slips away.
WCnotWAC
Posts: 6
Joined: Fri Nov 09, 2018 10:46 am

Re: Washington College 2019

Post by WCnotWAC »

I hear that John Nostrant '85 is finishing up at Haverford School and still wants to coach. That would certainly bring the alums back in the fold, and he's obviously a great coach.
LaxPundit07
Posts: 671
Joined: Mon Mar 18, 2019 3:34 pm

Re: Washington College 2019

Post by LaxPundit07 »

I hear you. The problem is: the support from the presidents I listed above and the financial issues at WAC make it very difficult to lay this all at Jeff Shirk's feet. I think the staff is responsible on some level for the downturn of the program. But, the school isn't supporting the sport as they should. They are not supporting it like it is their premier program. They are treating it like it is men's basketball or rowing. I am sorry, but men's lacrosse at Washington College was THE sport on that campus for decades. It competed for conference and national championships regularly, was always ranked and recruiting against the big dogs, and producing talent that would go on to play and coach at the highest levels (Rick Sowell and Steve Berger to name a few).
WASHFAN
Posts: 68
Joined: Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:14 am

Re: Washington College 2019

Post by WASHFAN »

Two small victories:
1. Added 315 alumni donors raising 51k for athletics.
2. Young guys got some game experience in McD blowout.
Like I said, small but I’ll take’em!
mdline
Posts: 30
Joined: Fri Dec 21, 2018 3:24 pm

Re: Washington College 2019

Post by mdline »

What would better support from the school look like? That's not a shot at the poster who suggested it wasn't adequate - I just don't know what that means on a day to day basis. The facilities are certainly what you'd expect from a program that seeks to be competitive, continuity in coaching staff which would seem to be indicative of a positive environment.
Shorelax100
Posts: 10
Joined: Tue Mar 12, 2019 8:36 am

Re: Washington College 2019

Post by Shorelax100 »

I few suggestions that could be made to get better support from the higher ups at WAC. Which have not been in support of the athletics department for the better part of 20 years now.

1) Fly them out to play in Colorado or on the West Coast one game a year. Great experience for the kids and can help gain some recruiting lines out West where more and more great lacrosse players are coming from.

2) Get some more financial aid for students who your program needs to go after. WAC is losing players because other schools are offering more in terms of financial aid packages or are cheaper and have beaten WAC in the past few years. WAC is making plenty of money, why bleed every penny you can and lose players just to buy more property around Chestertown?

3) Get on board with athletics PERIOD. Not even just lacrosse. I think lacrosse should be the premiere sport as it has been for the past 4-5 decades. Support the coaches in what they need, and just buy in. Too many people worried about money and not enough about the athletic department and growing the school.
WASHFAN
Posts: 68
Joined: Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:14 am

Re: Washington College 2019

Post by WASHFAN »

Well, another small victory versus the Mules, couldn’t see the game. From the recap, looks like we had a hard time at X, but we seemed to curtail some of the turnovers. Anybody see the game?
MrLax2U
Posts: 291
Joined: Tue Jul 31, 2018 1:09 pm

Re: Washington College 2019

Post by MrLax2U »

Like last year Sho'men are better than their W/L record. 3/4 of their 2019 losses IMO were winnable. Last year certainly 2 and one more with a bit of luck or in lacrosse parlance a couple inches.

Saturday 1pm WOTS. Sho'men will face a formidable Gull defense and a potential AA goalie. FOGO is having a banner year. Offense is playing loose and sloppy. Everybody wants to run up his numbers. Hoping for a disciplined, well played game by both sides with no injuries on the field and not too much student bad behavior off it. Years past one could tell a student fan from 20' away by the reek of beer ozzing from his pores. Better game on a warm Saturday afternoon than a cold mid week night.
WASHFAN
Posts: 68
Joined: Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:14 am

Re: Washington College 2019

Post by WASHFAN »

Hoping for a similar game to last years’ albeit with a much better day/crowd/fun. Credit is due, the F.O coupled with the D of the Gulls, is.....scary. Watched some of the CNU games last night...oh my...
MrLax2U
Posts: 291
Joined: Tue Jul 31, 2018 1:09 pm

Re: Washington College 2019

Post by MrLax2U »

Grieves has size, quickness, high lax IQ, MIAA plus D I experience and Sho’man DNA in his blood. WOTS 2018 he faced off against one of the great Gull poles and held his own on the board and more importantly nose to nose. Be interesting which pole Berkman sets on him Saturday. And how Grieves adjusts. He roams like Messi does for Barcelona in soccer so it’ll be mano a mano again. I bet he makes himself known.

From the few games I’ve streamed the Sho’man weakness seems to be their defensive coherence. Play a tight, simple 3/3 zone; sub like a knife through butter; hope your keeper gets that zone stare and see what happens.
COGULL
Posts: 103
Joined: Sun Feb 10, 2019 1:34 pm

Re: Washington College 2019

Post by COGULL »

Greeting WASHFAN & MrLax -
Hoping for a good game - Would love to see this rivalry pick up again.
MrLax - What's it going to take for the O to get a little love ?!?! LOL
WASHFAN
Posts: 68
Joined: Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:14 am

Re: Washington College 2019

Post by WASHFAN »

That was another Classic WOTS!!!!! Sho’men stepped up, just needed a finish. Great game.
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