LIBERTY LEAGUE 2019

D3 Mens Lacrosse
LibertyL
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Re: LIBERTY LEAGUE 2019

Post by LibertyL »

I know what is the dark sinister cabal thinking. Your matchups are sweet and actually very very
accurate and fair as well.
TopShelf585
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Joined: Fri Sep 07, 2018 3:00 pm

Re: LIBERTY LEAGUE 2019

Post by TopShelf585 »

After today I’m a believer that Liberty League should’ve had three. Centennial took three instead- Ursinus- F&M, & Gettysburg- all lost.
Empirelaxer
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Re: LIBERTY LEAGUE 2019

Post by Empirelaxer »

The committee seeded Ursinus and Gettysburg ahead of Union. Union crushed Springfield during the regular season and lost to Williams by 1 at Williams. But instead of third round rematch with Williams, they get RIT for the third time in less than three weeks. Absurd.
Redlax61
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Re: LIBERTY LEAGUE 2019

Post by Redlax61 »

Hind sight is always 20/20 vision and given that Ursinus was the AQ, that effectively took the SLU spot. I posted earlier this week the lack of respect the LL receives given the historical strength of both the NESCAC and Centennial in NCAA play continues to be problematic. Historically, the LL gets only 2 spots and when people think of the LL, they think of RIT. The rest of the LL has to work smart in terms of schedule and being visible with the committee come May. Dominance by RIT and weak historical positioning has worked against the rest of the league for years. The current state of Bard program does not help.

Agreed, Union to play RIT vs a NESCAC team at this point is ridiculous.
boredatwork
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Re: LIBERTY LEAGUE 2019

Post by boredatwork »

Redlax61 wrote: Fri May 10, 2019 7:00 am
Agreed, Union to play RIT vs a NESCAC team at this point is ridiculous.
At what point would it be acceptable in your eyes for Union to play RIT or a NESCAC school? I assume you also would find it ridiculous to play Salisbury or York at this point as well.

I think Union has had a great year, as have all the teams left in the tournament. There's 16 teams still playing, you have to play these teams at some point.
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Fast Break
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Re: LIBERTY LEAGUE 2019

Post by Fast Break »

boredatwork wrote: Fri May 10, 2019 11:01 am
Redlax61 wrote: Fri May 10, 2019 7:00 am
Agreed, Union to play RIT vs a NESCAC team at this point is ridiculous.
At what point would it be acceptable in your eyes for Union to play RIT or a NESCAC school? I assume you also would find it ridiculous to play Salisbury or York at this point as well.

I think Union has had a great year, as have all the teams left in the tournament. There's 16 teams still playing, you have to play these teams at some point.
I admit there is no perfect scenario in a field of 40 teams, and any number of issues could be raised regarding match-ups. At this point in the tournament, Union should be playing a team the caliber of RIT or any NESCAC opponent (5 of 7 possible North opponents). IMO, I think NESCAC opponent would be more appropriate. If Union was in the South bracket, a match-up with either Salisbury or York would be fine. The point being made by OP, is that he/she feels it is "ridiculous" that they are not playing a NESCAC opponent. Instead, Union will be playing it's third game vs. RIT, in less than 3 weeks. Ridiculous? Maybe not, but certainly not ideal for LL or NESCAC fans. Maybe third time will be a charm...

With 4 NESCAC schools in the North, I get why the two lowest seeds are facing one another in the second round. But it is interesting to see how the committee placed NESCAC Championship participants, Williams and Tufts, in opposite sides of the North Bracket. Where the LL Championship participants, RIT and Union, were placed on same side of bracket. I think most lax fans would love to see LL vs NESCAC match-ups. I understand that travel is a consideration, but that did not seem to impact the decision to have Stevenson (F&M) travel to Tufts in second round. I would have liked to see these teams more evenly spread across the North bracket to produce the most North Semi Final possibilities (LL v LL, NESCAC v NESCAC, or LL v NESCAC). Best team will emerge to compete against the South Bracket winner...Likely, Salisbury or York.
Last edited by Fast Break on Fri May 10, 2019 12:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
TopShelf585
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Re: LIBERTY LEAGUE 2019

Post by TopShelf585 »

boredatwork wrote: Fri May 10, 2019 11:01 am
Redlax61 wrote: Fri May 10, 2019 7:00 am
Agreed, Union to play RIT vs a NESCAC team at this point is ridiculous.
At what point would it be acceptable in your eyes for Union to play RIT or a NESCAC school? I assume you also would find it ridiculous to play Salisbury or York at this point as well.
I think Redlax's point was it's not fair to ask that these two LL teams play each other 3 times in three weeks. Union was a Pool C bid they could've spread out the chances of this happening in the tournament by having them elsewhere.

I'm sure most people in the forum would have welcomed Union playing Salisbury, York or any NESCAC school next instead of RIT.
Bad for the LL as only one can advance.
VTLaxGuy
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Re: LIBERTY LEAGUE 2019

Post by VTLaxGuy »

Empirelaxer wrote: Wed May 08, 2019 6:47 am Bard, now canceling games, including what would have been Ithaca’s senior day, is not helping strength of schedule even within the league
I could be wrong on this, but the way I understand it; having to play Bard (as RIT did) actually hurt the SOS, but getting the forfeit win from the canceled games (Union, SLU, Ithaca) doesn't negatively impact the number at all from an SOS standpoint. Because SOS is determined by games played, canceling the game actually helps those teams.

(I guess technically having to give Bard a spot on your schedule takes the place of a potential out of league game that could have helped things...but a cancel is better than playing them from an SOS standpoint)
ICGrad
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Re: LIBERTY LEAGUE 2019

Post by ICGrad »

boredatwork wrote: Fri May 10, 2019 11:01 am
Redlax61 wrote: Fri May 10, 2019 7:00 am
Agreed, Union to play RIT vs a NESCAC team at this point is ridiculous.
At what point would it be acceptable in your eyes for Union to play RIT or a NESCAC school?
I believe he was saying that having to play RIT yet again instead of an NESCAC school is ridiculous. RIT is the #2 team in the North, and they've played them twice in the last week. Would have been much more interesting to see both schools play someone else.

Hell, Union v. Tufts (I believe Ithaca played Tufts in the second round last year) is preferable to Union playing RIT again - not from a more winnable game perspective, but from a variety perspective.
Empirelaxer
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Re: LIBERTY LEAGUE 2019

Post by Empirelaxer »

That game tonight was a pretty example of why it would have been nice to see Union play someone else other than RIT.
Redlax61
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Re: LIBERTY LEAGUE 2019

Post by Redlax61 »

Empirelaxer wrote: Sat May 11, 2019 10:39 pm That game tonight was a pretty example of why it would have been nice to see Union play someone else other than RIT.
The case here is that once again the NESCAC has numerous teams (3 this year) having moved to the Final 8. From the original field of 32, I believe only Wesleyan and Amherst have played head to head so far. The consequence of the seeding in the round of 16, puts the 3 maximum potential NESCAC's into the round of 8. Wes lost in the NESCAC semi's and one could argue that the 4th spot from the NESCAC went to Wes despite numerous losses in the season ... with a big loss to Middlebury in the semi's (Who SLU handily defeated and was passed over).

For Union to play RIT 3 times in a week, when the NESCAC teams did not have the same NCAA path is an issue that has repeated itself year over year with the LL. Even as a SLU supporter, it would have been nice to see Union play someone else .... and anyone from the LL to not always be seeded against an LL opponent in the earlier rounds. This is a shout out for the LL which is a terrific league and has yet to truly earn more respect from the NCAA.

Fire away! :)
Last edited by Redlax61 on Tue May 14, 2019 5:05 pm, edited 2 times in total.
JumboFan4
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Re: LIBERTY LEAGUE 2019

Post by JumboFan4 »

Redlax61 wrote: Tue May 14, 2019 3:39 pm
Empirelaxer wrote: Sat May 11, 2019 10:39 pm That game tonight was a pretty example of why it would have been nice to see Union play someone else other than RIT.
The case here is that once again the NESCAC has numerous teams (3 this year) having moved to the Final 8. From the original field of 32, I believe only Wesleyan and Amherst have played head to head so far. The consequence of the seeding in the round of 16, puts the 3 maximum potential NESCAC's into the round of 8. Wes lost in the NESCAC semi's and one could argue that the 4th spot from the NESCAC went to Wes despite numerous losses in the season ... with a big loss to Middlebury in the semi's (Who SLU handily defeated and was passed over).

For Union to play RIT 3 times in a week, when the NESCAC teams did not have the same NCAA path is an issue that has repeated itself year over year with the LL. Even as a SLU supporter, it would have been nice to see Union play someone else .... and anyone from the LL and to not always be seeded against an LL opponent in the earlier rounds. This is a shout out for the LL which is a terrific league and has earned more respect from the NCAA.

Fire away! :)
I'm with you in that I'd like to see the NESCAC get spread more evenly over the North and South brackets. The fact that Tufts will have to basically run the gauntlet in their conference against Amherst and Williams (assuming Tufts and Williams make the semis) to reach the NC is not something that gets me particularly hyped.
I drive a Dodge Stratus.
D-III
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Joined: Mon Feb 11, 2019 11:06 am

Re: LIBERTY LEAGUE 2019

Post by D-III »

Redlax61 wrote: Tue May 14, 2019 3:39 pm
Empirelaxer wrote: Sat May 11, 2019 10:39 pm That game tonight was a pretty example of why it would have been nice to see Union play someone else other than RIT.
The case here is that once again the NESCAC has numerous teams (3 this year) having moved to the Final 8. From the original field of 32, I believe only Wesleyan and Amherst have played head to head so far. The consequence of the seeding in the round of 16, puts the 3 maximum potential NESCAC's into the round of 8. Wes lost in the NESCAC semi's and one could argue that the 4th spot from the NESCAC went to Wes despite numerous losses in the season ... with a big loss to Middlebury in the semi's (Who SLU handily defeated and was passed over).

For Union to play RIT 3 times in a week, when the NESCAC teams did not have the same NCAA path is an issue that has repeated itself year over year with the LL. Even as a SLU supporter, it would have been nice to see Union play someone else .... and anyone from the LL to not always be seeded against an LL opponent in the earlier rounds. This is a shout out for the LL which is a terrific league and has yet to truly earn more respect from the NCAA.

Fire away! :)
Focus your attention where it at least makes some sense. Yes, Wesleyan had “numerous” losses (3), so did St Lawrence (4). Wesleyan also had a Top-10 SOS and St Lawrence’s SOS wasn’t even in the Top-50. These teams resumes weren’t remotely comparable. NESCAC teams have met 3x on numerous occasions due to the NCAA seeding requirements.

That said, I agree Union should have been seeded #6 in the North ahead of two of the Centennial teams. The Committee made an odd (and bias) mistake there. Your gripe is with the Centennial who had all 3 teams get wiped out at home in their 1st game, and then all 3 teams who beat the Centennial teams lost by at least 5 goals in the next round. The Centennial had two Pool C teams who got in AFTER Wesleyan.
ICGrad
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Re: LIBERTY LEAGUE 2019

Post by ICGrad »

I feel like Charlie Brown, with Lucy van Pelt pulling the football away at the last second every time. I really thought this might be the year RIT brought it all home. :sigh:
ah23
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Re: LIBERTY LEAGUE 2019

Post by ah23 »

I don't care what the NESCAC stans say - this year proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that the the top of the LL can beat ANYONE from 5th seed down in that league.
TopShelf585
Posts: 261
Joined: Fri Sep 07, 2018 3:00 pm

Re: LIBERTY LEAGUE 2019

Post by TopShelf585 »

Man I love the way this RIT team plays. Fast all over the field, a battle for every gb, clear, ride, etc...
A tough way to go out for a great group of senior leaders.
Empirelaxer
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Re: LIBERTY LEAGUE 2019

Post by Empirelaxer »

There will be a new coach at Union next year

https://unionathletics.com/news/2019/5/ ... ement.aspx
Doid23
Posts: 57
Joined: Wed Apr 10, 2019 11:52 am

Re: LIBERTY LEAGUE 2019

Post by Doid23 »

Empirelaxer wrote: Tue May 21, 2019 3:29 pm There will be a new coach at Union next year

https://unionathletics.com/news/2019/5/ ... ement.aspx
...and what a way to end his career. He has made this program into a consistent winner, and one to be proud of. I used to laugh at the posters a few years back on LaxPower wondering if he had lost his fastball, and if it was time to retire. They weren't around for the two decades previous to Wehrum. Hopefully the next coach can continue his success.
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