Navy 2022

[HealthyDebate]

Any news on the search?

[youthathletics]

Yes, but it's a secret.

[HealthyDebate]

Sounds about right, exactly what they need, more secrecy. How about full transparency. Could help on and off field?

[youthathletics]

I was just playing around Healthy. I would not expect anything until the finals are over and even then into June. For recruiting purposes this summer, someone needs to be out there representing Navy, so I'd expect a decision early to mid June.

[laxxygilmore]

Any news on the search?

Yes, but it's a secret.

NAAA leadership is having the desert combed by Col. Sanders...

[laxpere]

I was just playing around Healthy. I would not expect anything until the finals are over and even then into June. For recruiting purposes this summer, someone needs to be out there representing Navy, so I'd expect a decision early to mid June.

Isn't that the reason that Coach Wellner was named Interim Head Coach? To reassure current returning players and the entering Plebe class? Keep the current recruiting pipeline intact and work the summer circuit on behalf of Navy Lacrosse? I think that he is very well equipped to fill that role.
I think that he would fit as Head Coach too, but is there is a risk that he decides to leave if the right program approaches him? He graduated from Chaminade and coached at Stony Brook so is Stony Brook a fit? Maybe LandM has an opinion? Different level to me, but what about Fairfield?
How about Coach Camposa? I think that he is there now, but what if he is approached by another program?
Go Navy Lacrosse v.2020!

[Dip&Dunk]

Would hope finals are not impacting anyone involved in the coach screening process.

I am not sure there is a “triple option” equivalent in lacrosse that SA’s can run that big time programs don’t recruit for.

Given though that Yale, UPenn, Duke, Cornell, UVA, Penn St., all schools with high academic standards, can bring in quality players, we cannot say that is prohibitive for Navy.

The lifestyle and commitment will always be different. Got it.

However, lax “scholarships” only go so far and that is not far enough. The average JHU lax player still has to be playing $30k+ per year after his 1/2 or 1/3 scholarship. Same for the schools mentioned above and many other lax D1 schools (Fairfield, Albany, etc.). Zero college debt and a job are great recruiting incentives today.

Maybe Navy is recruiting the wrong player? Just a thought.

[NElaxtalent]

Pure outsider here...I'm presuming Wellner gets the position. By all accounts I've seen he's very deserving (& has great projected recruiting classes coming in)..

But... if Wellner doesn't get it, wouldn't it be unlikely he remains on the staff (after being by-passed)? Would losing that continuity affect the committed recruits?

[HealthyDebate]

Pure outsider here...I'm presuming Wellner gets the position. By all accounts I've seen he's very deserving (& has great projected recruiting classes coming in)..

But... if Wellner doesn't get it, wouldn't it be unlikely he remains on the staff (after being by-passed)? Would losing that continuity affect the committed recruits?

I think there is a very real possibility he may end up some where else. I know Sowell is being mentioned at Stony Brook on other pages BUT I actually believe Wellner actually is the guy that ends up there. Long Islander, was there during their “good” years and has recruited very well off the Island. Don’t be surprised if Fairfield or Harvard are in on him. I’am very high on him clearly but that’s because he has proven to me he is ready.

[laxpere]

Would hope finals are not impacting anyone involved in the coach screening process.

I am not sure there is a “triple option” equivalent in lacrosse that SA’s can run that big time programs don’t recruit for.

Given though that Yale, UPenn, Duke, Cornell, UVA, Penn St., all schools with high academic standards, can bring in quality players, we cannot say that is prohibitive for Navy.

The lifestyle and commitment will always be different. Got it.

However, lax “scholarships” only go so far and that is not far enough. The average JHU lax player still has to be playing $30k+ per year after his 1/2 or 1/3 scholarship. Same for the schools mentioned above and many other lax D1 schools (Fairfield, Albany, etc.). Zero college debt and a job are great recruiting incentives today.

Maybe Navy is recruiting the wrong player? Just a thought.

Penn State is a solid school, but I'm not sure that it fits in your group. There might be other factors to consider, but acceptance rates and typical ACT scores are often considered decent indicators of academic standards. Based on 2016-7 data, Penn State accepted 56% of applicants and the typical ACT range was 25-29 so Ohio State might be a better comp at 54% and 27-31. Yale (6% and 32-35), Penn (9% and 32-36), Duke (11% and 31-34), and Cornell (14% and 31-34) all had significantly lower acceptance rates and stronger academic profiles based on the ACT. UVA's numbers are a bit of a step down (30% and 29-33) so it looks like UNC (27% and 28-33) and Michigan (29% and 29-33) might be good comps for UVA.

Maybe that was one of the factors for Coach Tambroni when he left Cornell in 2010 after 14 seasons? He was the Head Coach for ten seasons and Cornell made it to three NCAA final fours (2007/2009/2010) and the 2009 NCAA final so his departure sure seemed voluntary.

Won't recruiting for Navy Lacrosse (and the other service academies) always be challenging? What will be different for the next Head Coach, other than possibly alumni support at least at the outset? Not sure about "recruiting the wrong player" comment, but the lifestyle at USNA and a five-year service commitment (the job) are huge hurdles when competing for talented players who might be weighing several options. Maybe the end of early recruiting will help since players will be older when deciding, but the next Head Coach might need to be creative.

It seems that you're (or were) involved with USNA at an upper level so what type of player should Navy Lacrosse recruit? What has gone wrong from a recruiting standpoint? Maybe NAPS will be used less in the future, like the Lady Mids? Cole, Sweeney, and Barry were directs probably out of necessity, but could their 2019 success represent a new template going forward?

I am not sure how economic drivers play into the equation since every situation is unique, but zero debt just might not be a big enough incentive for many given the sacrifices required. My gut is the same for the vast majority of players at other schools who don't earn full rides. Not sure how each school allocates them, but I believe that a fully funded D-I lacrosse program is limited to 12.6 full scholarships for the entire team, or 3.15 per year. Plus, the Ivies don't award athletic scholarships, but the merit (financial aid?) packages might more than compensate for that restriction. I think that two of Cornell's seven schools are state schools where tuition is about 35% lower for New York residents, but not sure that advantage has been a big factor there. Isn't there a similar tuition discount for in-state kids at Penn State and Maryland too?

Despite the challenges, it seems that there is enough talent as Youth has highlighted. The 2019 Navy Lacrosse team was young at attack and on defense, but they gained valuable playing experience and the talented goalie has one year left. The future looks bright to me. Go Navy Lacrosse v.2020!

[thatsmell]

If my memory serves me, Tambroni left a winning and storied Ivy program, to go to PSU.

PSU has been slow on the uptake since he's been there, certainly not had the level of success he did at Cornell.

But now he has found some success and I'd assume the recruits are paying attention. PSU has shown they put their program on autopilot once they get their guy. They don't like to make changes very often. Thiel was there for how long after he wore out his welcome?

If the money is close, why would Tambroni leave that situation for a much more tenuous and difficult one at Navy?

[youthathletics]

Would hope finals are not impacting anyone involved in the coach screening process.
I am not sure there is a “triple option” equivalent in lacrosse that SA’s can run that big time programs don’t recruit for.
Zero college debt and a job are great recruiting incentives today.

Maybe Navy is recruiting the wrong player? Just a thought.

my 2 cents Dip&Dunk...appreciate the conversation.

Finals have come and gone at USNA, they were in the thick of it for about a week.

The triple option equivalent was stall ball for years and years at Navy...control the clock, even before RS arrived. The 80 second clock really mucked all that up and that is when Navy spent a ton of time on rides (one of the best early on)....limit the opponents offense, use Navy athleticism, then control the clock again. Where it broke down....our offense did not evolve. It was like playing the game battleship with a see through window to your opponents board, they knew exactly what we were going to do on almost every possession.

When a kid gives you his word he wants to attend USNA, then bails, does that mean you recruited the wrong kid? Of course not, It typically means the kid had no idea what they were "really" signing up for. But more to your point, the incentives post graduation, do not always align with the athletic sport specific skill set of the blue chippers who can hand pick where they want to go and what classes they will take (for the most part)...meaning the pickens are not as plentiful.

[laxpere]

Thatsmell,
Yes, his record at Cornell was excellent with no losing seasons as Head Coach too. I haven't seen anyone speculate that Coach Tambroni is leaving Penn State for Navy. That certainly wasn't my intent, but I was speculating on one of the reasons why he might have left Cornell. To me, a move to Navy Lacrosse by Coach Tambroni would be one of the most stunning moves ever. Given the forward momentum of the Penn State program, it would make very little sense.

There seemed to be other factors and an article in the Daily Collegian expanded on his move to Penn State after the 2010 season. His wife is a Penn State alumna too. The article was written by Paddy Cotter and published in the Daily Collegian on April 5, 2018, "At first, winning was everything. Then 3 tragedies shaped Jeff Tambroni’s coaching philosophy forever."

[laxxygilmore]

Would hope finals are not impacting anyone involved in the coach screening process.
I am not sure there is a “triple option” equivalent in lacrosse that SA’s can run that big time programs don’t recruit for.
Zero college debt and a job are great recruiting incentives today.

Maybe Navy is recruiting the wrong player? Just a thought.

my 2 cents Dip&Dunk...appreciate the conversation.

Finals have come and gone at USNA, they were in the thick of it for about a week.

The triple option equivalent was stall ball for years and years at Navy...control the clock, even before RS arrived. The 80 second clock really mucked all that up and that is when Navy spent a ton of time on rides (one of the best early on)....limit the opponents offense, use Navy athleticism, then control the clock again. Where it broke down....our offense did not evolve. It was like playing the game battleship with a see through window to your opponents board, they knew exactly what we were going to do on almost every possession.

When a kid gives you his word he wants to attend USNA, then bails, does that mean you recruited the wrong kid? Of course not, It typically means the kid had no idea what they were "really" signing up for. But more to your point, the incentives post graduation, do not always align with the athletic sport specific skill set of the blue chippers who can hand pick where they want to go and what classes they will take (for the most part)...meaning the pickens are not as plentiful.

It was like playing the game battleship with a see through window to your opponents board, they knew exactly what we were going to do on almost every possession.

+1...One of your all time best O comments regarding the past eight seasons. You nailed it.

[Sativa Specialist]

If there is no announcement as the tournament continues wouldn't mean Chet has his eye on a coach in the tournament ?

[SonnySide]

If there is no announcement as the tournament continues wouldn't mean Chet has his eye on a coach in the tournament ?

Yes you would think so. Or his top targets are still playing, and he wants to get a yes or no from them before he moves on to others that are finished. I am also sure that some of the coaches still playing will want to talk to Chet, at least to get their deal sweetened at their current school as well. Maybe Maryland and Loyola lose this weekend, and we go from there?

[LandM]

laxpere,
My two cents - if I was sitting in the AD chair, I would keep RW. He recruited most of the current and future players, been at the Academy and knows the culture, has a young settled family in the area and by now knows/understands the routine at a SA, and I am guessing that a few of the touted recruits are thinking of their commitment - if any are reading this, think about the education and opportunities upon graduation. Plus if I was his agent, nice bump in salary but probably not to the RS level.

The ground reality is that a cluster occurred, a person was set-up for failure and you probably have some tentative people but for the right money and opportunity anything is possible. I am probably way wrong but that big name score, ain't gonna happen.......but I have been surprised many a time.

RS or RW back at SBU is like taking Steve Spurrier back at FL or Lou Holtz at ND but this is lax.

Wish the young men and women who sign-up for the program, best of luck.

Go Navy except when they play Air Force;
Here is to my crisp $1

[runrussellrun]

Serious question: (asking for a friend )

Are the USNA coaches (lacrosse) subject to all manners of Federal Employee requirements? IE, drug testing. background checks, etc. Or, are they paid out of the strange Non-profit but we don't have to produce tax documents (huh????) secretive funds of the "friends of" fame?

[NYSection1]

Do any Navy lax alumni have info regarding the criteria for a new coach; specifically, would they be more interested in a former Naval officer?

[HealthyDebate]

I saw RW Wednesday on Long Island. He was wearing his Navy colors proudly. I did not get a chance to chat with him but did make note of him talking with some of the Chaminade and St. Anthony's parents and faculty. Could he have been meeting with SBU earlier in the day? BTW, both the Chaminade and St. Ant's Navy commits looked good in that game. For those wondering.